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Live Sources Database - FZ solos - Comments
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Zappa Penguin
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Post 2007-11-28 22:51   [Quote] 
pbuzby wrote:
Now You See It remains a mysterious solo.


IINK has this as Carbondale, 11/15/80. No complete tape (yet Smile ) circulates, but we know that this show was recorded by Zappa, and the Jazz Discharge Party Hats is from this show's performance of Torture Never Stops - even though Zappa wasn't the best with dates, he usually remained at least slightly consistent in his mistakes, so I see no reason to doubt him on this instance.

And excellent work, Ferval - but that goes without saying winko
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pbuzby
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Post 2007-11-29 01:55   [Quote] 
IIRC, the Neil Slaven book includes a quote from Zappa mentioning that Jazz Discharge came from a show in Southern Illinois, and I think I may have introduced the idea that this was from the Carbondale show FZ mentions in the TTR liner notes. I think the SBD fragment used to circulate without a date. CU's giglist mentions that they also played in Normal, IL on this tour.

In any case, the Now You See It mystery I had in mind is that we don't know what song it comes from. It may have been a "one-off" vamp, like 10-15-78 early, 10-27-78 early, 4-1-79 and a few others.

BTW, someone mentioned on a.f.f-z once that someone requested Mudshark at this Carbondale show and FZ said "why not?" and performed it. (http://groups.google.com/group/alt.fan.frank-zappa/browse_thread/thread/c05b4fd9392eeeb5/7af63151b29b1045?lnk=st&q=Carbondale+group%3Aalt.fan.frank-zappa#7af63151b29b1045)
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Zappa Penguin
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Post 2007-11-29 03:04   [Quote] 
pbuzby wrote:
IIRC, the Neil Slaven book includes a quote from Zappa mentioning that Jazz Discharge came from a show in Southern Illinois, and I think I may have introduced the idea that this was from the Carbondale show FZ mentions in the TTR liner notes. I think the SBD fragment used to circulate without a date. CU's giglist mentions that they also played in Normal, IL on this tour.


Welp, looks like we're back to square one, then.

pbuzby wrote:
In any case, the Now You See It mystery I had in mind is that we don't know what song it comes from. It may have been a "one-off" vamp, like 10-15-78 early, 10-27-78 early, 4-1-79 and a few others.


Oscar, in his Touring Can Make You Crazy page, lists it as an "opening solo over King Kong vamp". The vamp does sound similar to a free-form KK vamp in 81-82, and at the very end of the song (4:50 or thereabouts), Tommy plays the lead riff to KK in a very mellow, cocktail-jazz sort of style. Whether or not this is actually a guitar-solo-only KK, or if Tommy just happened to quote KK, is up for debate.

What's most striking about this song is that it's pretty much the first example of a Zappa band playing straight reggae - right? It definitely predates the reggae-laden tours of 1981 and beyond, in any case.

pbuzby wrote:
BTW, someone mentioned on a.f.f-z once that someone requested Mudshark at this Carbondale show and FZ said "why not?" and performed it. (http://groups.google.com/group/alt.fan.frank-zappa/browse_thread/thread/c05b4fd9392eeeb5/7af63151b29b1045?lnk=st&q=Carbondale+group%3Aalt.fan.frank-zappa#7af63151b29b1045)


11/30 Des Moines might have some competition in the 1980 Weird-Off...

I certainly wouldn't complain if this show was put up on DaD, or officially released, for that matter.

Thanks for the history lesson. Smile
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pbuzby
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Post 2007-11-29 03:49   [Quote] 
Zappa Penguin wrote:
Quote:

What's most striking about this song is that it's pretty much the first example of a Zappa band playing straight reggae - right? It definitely predates the reggae-laden tours of 1981 and beyond, in any case.


There's a bit of reggae as far back as Take Your Clothes Off When You Dance in 75/76, but the first reggae guitar solos came with The Deathless Horsie in fall '78. You're right that '81 was the first tour where FZ had the band play reggae under just about *every* guitar solo at some shows.
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Ferval Lankman
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Post 2007-11-29 21:14   [Quote] 
OK, this should be close to done (for the time being). Interesting to see that 18 of the 33 tracks on Guitar are either not currently on the tracker or don't even circulate.
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rushomancy
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Post 2007-11-30 13:59   [Quote] 
Impressive effort, Ferval. Thanks!
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pbuzby
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Post 2007-11-30 14:20   [Quote] 
Ferval Lankman wrote:
OK, this should be close to done (for the time being). Interesting to see that 18 of the 33 tracks on Guitar are either not currently on the tracker or don't even circulate.


A few of those shows are on my to-do list.
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Ferval Lankman
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Post 2007-11-30 18:20   [Quote] 
pbuzby wrote:
A few of those shows are on my to-do list.

That's always a good sentence to read.

pbuzby - while you're here, could you give a quick rundown on what we know about the He Used To Cut The Grass/Graz speculation. I know you have relayed it to me, RE: CU's research into the union paperwork, etc., but as you're one step closer to the source(s) for that info I'd hate to get in the middle and add another generation.
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pbuzby
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Post 2007-11-30 20:45   [Quote] 
I think all we know there is that the log sheets for the Joe's Garage sessions include a piece titled "E Solo From Graz," and that CU has a recording of Steven Rosen interviewing FZ where FZ apparently refers to the solo as "the one from Graz."
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richast2
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Post 2007-12-18 01:56   [Quote] 
sources courtesy of IINK

FZPTMOFZ available sources:
Black Napkins 11/22/75 Ljubljana, Yugoslavia [not on tracker]
Black Napkins [Zoot Allures album version] 02/03/76 Osaka
Zoot Allures 02/05/76 Tokyo [not on tracker]
Merely A Blues In A 09/27/74 Paris [not on tracker]
Watermelon in Easter Hay 02/24/78 Eppelheim, Germany

Them Or Us available sources not already listed:
Marque-son's Chicken solo from 06/19/82 (late) [not on tracker]
Whipping Post solo edited together from 12/11/81 Santa Monica and 12/12/81 San Diego [neither on tracker]

DHBIM? available sources:
Zoot Allures solo from 10/26/84 Providence [not on tracker]
Trouble Every Day solo from 09/25/84 London
Penguin In Bondage solo, most of track from 12/18/84 Vancouver (late)
Hot Plate Heaven from from 12/18/84 Vancouver (late)
What's New In Baltimore front and solo from 12/23/84 Universal City, CA
Let's Move To Cleveland guitar solo from 10/28/84 Amherst, Massachusetts [not on tracker]
Whipping Post entire song from 12/23/84 Universal City, CA

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richast2
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Post 2007-12-18 02:06   [Quote] 
QuADIOPHILIAc source:
Venusian Time Bandits (solo from Trouble Every Day) 10/01/74 (early)

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Ferval Lankman
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Post 2007-12-18 03:43   [Quote] 
Thanks for those, richast2. I had meant to add those FZPTMOFZ solos and it completely slipped my mind.

Many of the others are going into the list(s) I'm working on next: basic track sources, followed by complete live track sources (which should cover the DHBIM? listings). Eventually I hope to have a full list cross-linking all of the live/partly-live tracks on official releases and their original concerts.
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richast2
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Post 2007-12-18 04:09   [Quote] 
I've got something big planned for tomorrow evening myself. Stay tuned!

edit: but sadly not a show Sad

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tsotelo
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Post 2007-12-18 11:52   [Quote] 
Maybe this thread must be on Catalogue.

Best regards.
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Yojimbo
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Post 2007-12-18 13:16   [Quote] 
Quote:
That's Not Really Reggae
(solo from Whipping Post)
1984 09 25 London, UK - not currently available on the tracker

Yes it is!
Is there a big interest in getting the NCAOT's up? I'm often having problems deciding what shows to transfer, so I wouldn't mind focusing on these shows.
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